Thinking Anglicans

General Synod: elections

The results of elections just held among General Synod members to fill various posts are as follows. (Stage numbers refer to the process of election by the method of Single Transferable Vote.)

Three clergy places on the Crown Nominations Commission:

  • The Very Revd Colin Slee (Deans) (Stage 4)
  • The Revd Canon Peter Spiers (Liverpool) (Stage 5)
  • The Revd Canon Glyn Webster (York) (Stage 6)

Three laity places on the Crown Nominations Commission:

  • Mr Aiden Hargreaves-Smith (London) (Stage 10)
  • Professor Glynn Harrison (Bristol) (Stage 10)
  • Mrs Mary Johnston (London) (Stage 6)

One clergy place on the Ministry Council:

  • The Very Revd Michael Sadgrove (Deans) (stage 9)

In addition to these the Revd Prebendary David Houlding has been elected to fill a casual vacancy on the Archbishops’ Council.

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Davis d'Ambly
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Davis d'Ambly

Care to translate for Americans as to what is a Single Transferable Vote and how the Stages apply? We definitely speak a different language in these matters!

Anthony Archer
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Anthony Archer

Single transferable vote (STV) is a preferential voting system. STV initially allocates an individual’s vote to their most preferred candidate, and then subsequently transfers unneeded or unused votes after candidates are either elected or eliminated, according to the voter’s stated preferences. In political terms it is a system that supports proportional representation, as opposed to the first past the post system that operates in US elections and indeed UK parliamentary elections. With a slate of candidates for an election (say 10), each elector rank orders their votes and marks the candidates from 1 to 10. The first preference votes for… Read more »

Peter Owen
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The Single Transferable Vote system (STV) is simple for the voter, but rather complicated for the person who has to count the votes. Voters put the candidates in order of preference. For the laity vote for the CNC there were 12 candidates for three places, so voters number the candidates 1, 2, 3, … There is no requirement to continue all the way to 12 if a voter does not want to. To be elected a candidate must reach a quota of votes equal to number of valid ballot papers divided by (number of places + 1). First preference votes… Read more »

Simon Sarmiento
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Peter mentions that there were 12 lay candidates for 3 places for the CNC.
There were 8 candidates for the 3 clergy places.

Hugh of Lincoln
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Hugh of Lincoln

Credit where credit is due. Nice to see PR used in CofE!

Joan R
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Joan R

FWIW, a proportional vote can be counted via computer program, which is how we do it in the Diocese of Massachusetts. Ballots are keyed in with a simple data entry program, and the program does all the heavy lifting of calculating the results. An election with three contests and a bit over 400 ballots usually takes a couple or three hours to count, with a group of 9 committee members and volunteers.

Joan Rasch

Davis d'Ambly
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Davis d'Ambly

Thanks all. Most helpful!

David H
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David H

So what does this all mean? I recognise a conservative from Durham and a liberal from Southwark. Are the various factions fairly represented?

Merseymike
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Merseymike

It looks somewhat polarised to me.

NP
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NP

All this may look very different in a year’s time…..especially if we have AC (with Covenant) and TEC Global with some in the CofE going to TEC Global

Ford Elms
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Ford Elms

“TEC Global”

Why do you never call the Anglican Church CofE Global? Seems to me TEC is in a very similar position WRT the worldwide Anglican Church as the C of E was 500 years ago WRT the Western Church.

NP
Guest
NP

I talk of “TEC Global” bceause I see it as the new liberal “church” that will emerge out of the Anglican split that appears to be coming…..the CofE will remain part of the AC which is more than the CofE ( which is a small part of a global communion!)

Ford Elms
Guest
Ford Elms

“the CofE will remain part of the AC “ My point, NP, is that 500 years ago, the CofE WAS the AC. It was a small group of bishops who were attached in varying degrees to the new trendy rebellious ideas coming out of places like Geneva, ideas that contradicted everything the Church had stood for for 1500 years. England was weak, it’s king was the son of usuper, and the Church backed up his plans to divorce, quite unjustly, his legal wife, then turned a blind eye while he proceded to murder or divorce several others, all the while… Read more »

NP
Guest
NP

Ford – completely agree, the CofE was born in shame….but I think it was redeemed by its greats eg Cranmer and brought back to the bible…it became much more than Henry’s vehicle for a divorce….but it has always been compromised, sadly, by its relationships with states and kings etc I have no problem with TEC or the GS walking away if they have to do so in all good conscience….I have a problem with those who would force us all into further fudges and false unity for the sake of appearing to maintain an institution……I have a problem with “Griswoldian”… Read more »

Pluralist
Guest

Far more likely is Church of Nigeria (Anglican Communion) – or Nigerial Global by its actions and intentions. Or maybe Sydney Global, or Walkers Off Global. Once again, all this requires a reversal of intentions (on all sides now). This prophecy is at least as good as yours NP, until the outcome is actually known, for which it will take, yet, meetings, replies, reactions, all over the shop.

Repeating something over and over again does not make it happen.

NP
Guest
NP

Pluralist….you are still in denial….my predictions are based on the ACTIONS of the liberal ABC

I have evidence for where I think we ar going(TWR, Dromantine, Tanzania, Covenant)….what evidence do you have that the ABC is suddenly going to let the AC spllit for the sake of VGR?

Ford Elms
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Ford Elms

“brought back to the bible” NP, I respect that you are to all intents and purposes a fundamentalist (with no negative connotation intended in my use of that word). Can you not respect that there is a tradition that does not put all authority in Scripture? I make no claims as to whether that tradition is right or wrong, or whether it can err (and your position can also lead to error, NP), merely that it exists, and some of us believe it. Second, can you not also try to understand that your continual insistence on Biblical “proof” for one… Read more »

Simon Sarmiento
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I am at a loss to understand how the General Synod elections reported above will look different in a year’s time. NP said:
“if we have AC (with Covenant) and TEC Global with some in the CofE going to TEC Global”

How is it possible for “some in the CofE” to go anywhere else?

Pluralist
Guest

Let’s put it like this. The Archbishop of Canterbury is concerned that the split will lose the contact between different cultures of the Western and developing worlds. However, he may rest assured that not every province in the developing world is going to walk off now – the hardcore is not quite so large as thought and not quite so uniform. It could include the Archbishop of Sydney and under him. On the other hand, to stop them walking he has to exclude TEC, and almost certainly Canada as well, with a huge loss of finance, and then will see… Read more »

Malcolm+
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Malcolm+

I suggest, NP, that you are the one in denial.

Akinola and his minions have planned their exit from the Anglican Communion for some years, and now they are executing their plan.

Enjoy the Akinolist Communion, NP. But don’t expect to take your parish property with you.

NP
Guest
NP

Ford – I accept your points….but as you know, I think it is an error to give so much authority to current tradition that some want to ignore scripture. Pluralist talks of “the moderate, defining heart of Anglicanism”……you mean TEC et al??? Surely not. TWR is more representative of the views of moderate Anglicans…is it not? Simon-why is it impossible for some who might like the Covenant and greater discipline in the CofE to join a new TEC-led church? Malcolm – how many times….I ain’t so worried about property because thousands of Anglicans in our churches in London give generously….we… Read more »

Simon Sarmiento
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NP

For CofE people to do that (without moving to the USA) the Episcopal Church would have to set up congregations etc. in England. Why do you think that is likely?

And my main point was that members of CofE parishes choosing to decamp from the CofE are quite unable to take any church property with them, no matter what their reasons for leaving or the strength of their numbers.

Pluralist
Guest

I think it is possible for the Church of England to become somethng like a shell, with moneys being diverted and old rules habitually broken, and bishops trying to impose tendencies (sometimes to seculre money) and not a little competition. It is a kind of nightmare scenario. Before it gets there one phenomenon might be a limited number of large congregations buying a hall and putting themselves under a Nigerian consecrated bishop or three, leaving some rump parishes to be redeveloped by the Church of England. These, then, would be outside the Church of England, whatever Anlgicanism they would be… Read more »

NP
Guest
NP

Simon…not so worried about property – healthy churches can always buy more and do not rely on dead people’s money to survive or thrive. Also, I was talking about TEC leading some sort of “TEC Global” allinace of liberal churches – which would be open to people in England too….although, they must not think they can take their property, right? THe reasons I think TEC may do something like that: -TEC’s name change, removing its specific US link; – TEC’s show at GC06 of many countries’ flags showing their global presence; – TEC’s spending on building international links….eg nice little… Read more »

Ford Elms
Guest
Ford Elms

“I think it is an error to give so much authority to current tradition that some want to ignore scripture.”

We agree! That is, unless you can actually use “current tradition” to refer to something 2000 years old. Your definition of “current” is as odd as your definition of “low Church”. But then, you seem to define “ignore Scripture” to mean “doesn’t believe the way I do”.

NP
Guest
NP

Ford…I have stayed all these years in the CofE because I can tolerate difference……I have the greatest respect for my high church Bishop of London and also for you! -so, given I can tolerate difference, something must have changed and that something was a small minority in the AC trying to force us all over the world to accept a change in what is required of clergy which we have not agreed to make. Now, I know you are not a militant rights campaigner and also do not think TEC should have behaved as it did…..but my point is that… Read more »

Malcolm+
Guest
Malcolm+

It is always amusing to read NP’s misplaced optimism.

Of course, the Episcopal Church removed the USA from its name because it has for more than a century had provinces and dioceses that were outwith the United States.

But what the Episcopal Church has never removed was the reference to communion with Canterbury.

That was your pals as part of their well thought out plan to decamp if their coup d’eglise was unsuccessful.

NP
Guest
NP

Malcolm…you are amused by my “optimism”…..so, before Tanzania, you were expecting a communque similar to the one we got from the ABC and the other Primates??? I am optimistic – based on TWR and the Tanzania Communique, the ABC and the Primates do not seem minded to let one province unilaterally change an AC position….. Bore of this cycle: NP – look at what the ABC has DONE in the last few years eg in Tanzania; Malcolm – you are dreaming NP; NP – but, Malcolm… look at what the ABC has actually DONE; Malcolm – you are dreaming and… Read more »

Ford Elms
Guest
Ford Elms

“tolerance of evos in the CofE / AC” Tolerance of what? I mean really, tolerance of someone in another parish doing things you don’t like? Tolerance of a bishop on the other side of the planet who believes and teaches things you think are wrong? Well, welcome to my world! I think the bishop of Sydbey is a heretic and I really don’t know if I could receive communion in one of his churches. But I really don’t want to split the Church over it, he’s on the other side of the planet. Besides, I could be wrong about him,… Read more »

NP
Guest
NP

Ford – you really need to get this straight: I am not saying that I am right! You are a man who respects church tradition and order….you should not really be objecting to me saying that I want to stick to the agreed positions of the Anglican church….these agreements between our Primates raise issues re VGR, do they not? Forget about your anger vs evos…..I know you think TEC acted inappropriately in 2003 – but you then think the rest of us in the AC should have to accept their fait accompli even though most of us disagree with what… Read more »

Ford Elms
Guest
Ford Elms

“these agreements between our Primates raise issues re VGR, do they not?” It’s hardly that clear. Underlying agendas, complex politics, and influence by outside lobby groups, these things might be there in TEC’s actions, but they are definitely there, prominently, in the actions of the “reasserters”. I know you can’t see this. Too bad. Your naivety is your problem. “you then think the rest of us in the AC should have to accept their fait accompli” Why not? Answer the question, I see no reason to split the Church over Peter Akinola, though I see far less evidence of Christian… Read more »