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More on Kearon's visit to the Executive Council

Some members of the TEC Executive Council have now written more about this event, which is first reported on here.

Mark Harris has written Canon Kearon on Faith and Order: It is about troublesome TEC.

In that meeting Kearon said that The Episcopal Church does not “share the faith and order of the vast majority of the Anglican Communion.” What precisely did he mean by that?

He argued that “The Commission on Unity Faith and Order is central to our way forward as a communion. and a lot of effort has gone into making it balanced.” He argued that “There is a logic which says if you do not share the faith and order of the wider communion then you shouldn’t represent that communion to the wider church.”

All of this makes matters of sexuality – particularly the matters addressed in the moratoria on same-sex blessings and episcopal ordination of partnered gay or lesbian persons – matters of “faith and order.” Now how does that happen? What precisely is this business of Faith and Order?

Katie Sherrod has written a detailed account of this event, see Canon Kearon speaks. One sample:

It began with Canon Kearon telling Bishop Katharine that he wanted the session to be private, with staff and press put out of the room. He talked about how the press was the enemy of us all and that bloggers would take anything that was said and distort it.

So Bishop Katharine said, “All those in favor of a closed session, please raise your hands.” Four or five hands went up.

“All opposed?” Hands went up all over the room. The session remained open to everyone.

There is a lot more on the substance of the discussion.

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Richard Ashby
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Richard Ashby

I read this with my early morning cup of tea with mounting disbelief that this had actually happened. It’s extraordinary, inept, rude, inadequate, stupid, insulting – I am running out of epithets. What an extraordinary performance. OK Canon Kearon was sent there to defend the indefensible and coming from the Church of Ireland may be some defence but he has done nothing to heal the developing breach with TEC and in fact made it worse by his failure of understanding and his ignorance. I thought the killer question at the end, about the Old Catholics and the Swedish Church was… Read more »

Jeremy Pemberton
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Jeremy Pemberton

I think we should be making something of the Old Catholic and Swedish connection. If the Church of England remains in communion with two churches or groups of churches that manage to have blessing for same-sex relationships and a lesbian bishop, then why are we so anxious about people in the USA and Canada doing this? And certainly there is NO justification for trying to exclude them from ecumenical dialogues that may include Old Cathpolics and members of the Church of Sweden!!

Simon Sarmiento
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Bishop David Hamid, writing on his blog about the recent Anglican and Old Catholic Bishops Meeting, has noted this:
http://eurobishop.blogspot.com/2010/06/anglcian-and-old-catholics-bishops.html

“The decision by the Secretary General of the Anglican Communion, subsequent to the Archbishop of Canterbury’s letter, to ask the Revd Carola Von Wrangel from the Episcopal Church to step down from membership on the Anglican-Old Catholic Coordinating Council was received with sadness by the bishops. We noted that the Coordinating Council is not strictly speaking an ecumenical dialogue, but an instrument of Churches already in communion, so we will be following up this matter with the Anglican Communion Office.”

Pat O'Neill
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Pat O'Neill

I suspect that–even after all these years–the real fly in the ointment is that TEC treats its laity and clergy as equals in matters of policy and polity…something much of the rest of the Communion simply doesn’t understand at all: “You mean, the bishops can’t just tell them not to do this?”

Jeremy
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Jeremy

Continuing kudos to the TEC Executive Council for keeping this Q&A session open to the press and on the public record.

If the Archbishop of Canterbury is going public, with his soi-disant “Pentecost Letter” and with mitregate, then there’s no reason why TEC shouldn’t as well.

Sunshine is the best disinfectant. Here the public record shows the ACO’s position for what it is: desperate middle-of-the-roadism that is riddled with illogic and indeed incompetence.

Fr Mark
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Jeremy Pemberton: “If the Church of England remains in communion with two churches or groups of churches that manage to have blessing for same-sex relationships and a lesbian bishop, then why are we so anxious about people in the USA and Canada doing this?” Even more than that; the Church of Sweden now marries, not just blesses, gay couples, I understand, as does the Old Catholic Church in Sweden; the Church of Iceland and the Church of Norway are in the process of moving to doing the same, as the law in each of their countries has recently changed to… Read more »

Susannah Clark
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Mr Kearon – The Episcopal Church does not “share the faith and order of the vast majority of the Anglican Communion.” Really? I thought faith in Christ and love of God and others was pretty important, and like the growing majority in the UK and many other places, I regard discrimination on grounds of sexual orientation as less and less acceptable – no more acceptable than racism or sexism. The thing is, a growing number of people within Rowan Williams Church of England province identify *far* more with the Episcopal Church’s openness and diversity than with the constraints placed on… Read more »

Adam Armstrong
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Adam Armstrong

Saying that TEC does not share the “faith and order” of the Anglican Communion, supposedly on behalf of Canterbury, is very troubling. Duncan and ACNA and the homophobes of the GS can shout this from the rooftops, yet it is utterly untrue. Neither faith nor order are about homosexuality-there is nothing about it in the Creeds, etc. Since when have all bishops been straight? The problem seems to be admitting that gay people exist and that some of them are clergy. This from England via Ireland? What century is this?

Richard Zevnik
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Richard Zevnik

Time to skip to six and save breath and ink. +Cantuar is the Neville Chamberlain of our time and circumstances.

faithful tadpole
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faithful tadpole

As a former student and present colleague of Ken Kearon’s, I think it’s fair to say that his performance at TEC Executive Council was not the high point of his career, and reflected no glory on the Church of Ireland. Mind you,I’m not quite sure what was meant above by his Irish origin being some excuse for what happened.. It seems that certain political/bureaucratic roles force a person into saying what one would have hoped they would not believe. To say that TEC does not share Anglican Faith and Order is nonsense. Yes, they are further advanced along a certain… Read more »

Erika Baker
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Erika Baker

Susannah
“We now have hundreds of people signed up around the world.”

Maybe you can tell me how to sign up? I don’t find a “join this group” or anything like that on Facebook, only the option to “like”.

Father Ron Smith
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Father Ron Smith

“Mind you,I’m not quite sure what was meant above by his Irish origin being some excuse for what happened..” – faithful tadpole –

Perhaps this comes into the area of ‘legerdemain’ – the art of ‘trickery or conjuring, sleight of hand; jugglery’ (Chambers dictionary).

It obviously suited Canon Kearon to absent himself from blame for the ‘mitre-gate’ fiasco. And who wouldn’t, in the circumstances? Mind you, I would not blame the C.of Ireland for his provenance.

Caelius Spinator
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Caelius Spinator

Perhaps, the Episcopal Church (and any other Provinces that are interested) should leave the Anglican Communion and join the Porvoo Communion. That Communion seems to find common ground in Jesus Christ as opposed to whatever false idols are being worshipped by the ACO these days.

JCF
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JCF

Re lesbian bishops in the Church of Sweden: the CofE has NO means to order them not, and they (Rowan & Co) KNOW it. All they can do, is not attend (which is their right—after all, those of us in favor of same-sex marriage ALWAYS say, it’s quite alright not to attend, if you don’t approve!). Rowan & Co have NO more means to order TEC around, either . . . they just don’t seem to realize that they don’t! So instead they huff, and puff, and assume that we (Piskies) will act on our OUR instinctive guilt, and “niceness”,… Read more »

Susannah Clark
Guest

Erica, ‘like’ is the only response I can find for signalling support on the facebook page (I’m not very familiar with facebook!) – but I guess ‘like’ is an adequate expression of agreement. If I had time I’d try to find some way of adapting the page and making it more interactive and responsive but it will need to wait as I am catching a bus in 50 minutes time – going for a 10 day stay in a convent, as I explore vocation. I look forward to the day when all men and women are able to participate fully… Read more »

drdanfee
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drdanfee

What Mark Harris said, what Katie Sherrod said …alas poor Canon K, he is already policing, and he knows it … he just did not expect to be so obviously on the hook in wide open public. Thanks to all who voted for that Exec meeting to remain open.

If studied secrecy, power mongering, and double talk when it comes to empirical data, as well as when it comes to fair treatment of ‘diverse’ folks is the real cue for global Anglican Faith and Order, I am guessing Rowan Williams and Canon K can just count me out.

Pantycelyn
Guest
Pantycelyn

I cannot see Rowan continuing in office for much longer – can you ?

Pantycelyn
Guest
Pantycelyn

My last comment was probably more of wishful thinking than anything else. I personally feel so betrayed and deceived by him, alas.