Sunday, 30 October 2011

Sunday afternoon updates on St Paul's Cathedral

Updated 11 pm

The Dean and Bishop met some protesters today.

Guardian Lizzy Davies and Haroon Siddique Bishop defends ‘prudent’ legal steps for possible eviction of St Paul’s camp and some pictures here.

BBC St Paul’s protest camp: Bishop calls for no violence (with video)

And earlier, Is the Church inside or outside the establishment?

Channel 4 News this evening’s video report: Evictions ‘prudent’ for protesters

Coming in Monday’s Guardian
Occupy London: silence of once-critical clerics is infuriating but understandable by Riazat Butt
The St Paul’s situation puts Rowan Williams and other bishops who have decried banking practices in an impossible quandary.

She concludes:

…The archbishops’ silence – and that of the wider church – on the crisis at the cathedral is extraordinary, then, given their past remarks. But the truth is they gain nothing from commenting on it.

Siding with protesters would undermine the bishop of London and the dean of St Paul’s, who are already under fire for their actions, and represent an extrajudicial intervention not often seen in the Church of England. To ally themselves with their beleaguered colleagues would make them hypocrites. Those who have aired their views are retired – like Lord Carey – or relatively unknown outside Anglican circles.

However infuriating their reticence, the clerics who bashed the bankers during the global financial meltdown are unlikely to put themselves forward to debate the merits or otherwise of Occupy London, a subject made toxic by the prospect of eviction, but it is inconceivable that they do not have opinions on the events at St Paul’s.

Madeleine Bunting Occupy London is a nursery for the mind

…The critics complain that there are no clearly identified objectives, no manifesto. But this is not some proto-political party. Critics insist there must be leaders or representatives. But the protesters stubbornly refuse to conform to any of the conventions of our political and media culture. That is why the invitation from the Bishop of London, Richard Chartres, for representatives to join a panel discussion with business leaders was so inept. The protesters are challenging how the illusion of public debate is created through a stage-managed process that excludes all but a self-regarding elite who are largely in agreement, quibbling only over technocratic detail…

Posted by Simon Sarmiento on Sunday, 30 October 2011 at 6:14pm GMT | TrackBack
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Categorised as: Church of England
Comments

Without the bankers and the city there would be no Church of Eng;land stipends and pensions. Bankers do a lot of good and we owe much to them.

Posted by: robert ian williams on Sunday, 30 October 2011 at 7:49pm GMT

I wonder if his Grace and the chapter have any clue how incredibly tone deaf they are, and how bad they look to the rest of the world, bad by the measure of the Magnificat that (I presume) they say daily.

Posted by: Counterlight on Sunday, 30 October 2011 at 8:27pm GMT

"Bankers do a lot of good and we owe much to them."

They're not entitled to rule over the rest of us. We are not obliged to defer to them. And they are subject to the same law as all the rest of us. They shouldn't be able to gamble with our money and defraud us all with impunity just because they bought off the government and own all of the political parties.

"Laws, like the spider's web, catch the small flies and let the big ones go free." -- Balzac

Posted by: Counterlight on Monday, 31 October 2011 at 11:45am GMT

@Counterlight

The bankers don't rule over the rest of us. They are regulated through Parliament and our elected government, as I'm sure you know, and regulation has been tightened further.

I don't see how anybody can engage with a protest which compares the City with - for example - 'classical fascists' justifies its design as:

"Note the use of VirusFonts typeface, Bastard. We think it is a rather apt choice of typeface, considering the ideology of the typeface: the reinterpretation of blackletter semiotics and insinuation that multinational corporations are akin to the new fascists."

http://virusfonts.com/news/2011/10/the-occupied-times/

How does one engage with that stuff?

This is why - them having had their right to a protest allowed by everybody, this has now become simply a case of obstruction and a policing matter.

Posted by: Matt on Monday, 31 October 2011 at 5:03pm GMT

"Bankers do a lot of good and we owe much to them."

At least they make the trains run on time, eh?

The comparison to fascists is apt - taking much, giving little, dictating societal structuring through purchased influence. And . . . please . . . the idea that those whose comfort depends on capitalism running as wildly free as possible would actually "engage" with those suffering under its bestial nature is laughable.

By "engage," I take it you mean get them to shut up and let you live your complacent life.

I have no problem stating that you cannot call yourself a disciple of Christ and support the ideology of capitalism - the two are entirely inconsistent.

Posted by: MarkBrunson on Tuesday, 1 November 2011 at 6:33am GMT

What a silly view..Bankers do not rule over the world...that is only one dangeroius step from claiming like some do ( both the nutty left and right), that they are all Jewish or it is a CIA conspiracy.

Be balanced..modern day banking is a success story, and has done us much good. I suggest critics , remove all their money from a bank, if they are so "principled."

Posted by: Robert ian Williams on Tuesday, 1 November 2011 at 7:27am GMT

I reiterate:

You live a comfortable life, so you care nothing for the suffering the finance industry engenders. I pray you have a chance to learn directly how those who've "fallen through the cracks" experience life - it may teach you humility.

In the meantime, you cannot be a follower of Christ and a full-fledged capitalist; sorry.

And, finally, if you honestly believe that *you* have the same influence as a multi-millionaire over your government, then you might want to look at which of us has a silly view.

Posted by: MarkBrunson on Wednesday, 2 November 2011 at 3:52am GMT
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