Comments: General Synod - more Saturday reports and comments

'this is not simply a matter of opinion but of obedience: obedience to Scripture, to Tradition, to the wider consensus of the universal Church.'

Ah this is the nub of their contention- in a nut shell "we are right, you are wrong- and How Wrong !" And this is them, trying to be reasonable and eirenic ! Just imagine what their true views are uttered in private over gin !

There is no reason why protestants in C21st need to give in to this kind of doctrinaire approach.

Also after the behaviour of the previous PEVs, one is left a little disinclined to heed the new batch over-much.

I'm usually pretty easy-going, live and let live but I have really lost trust in the honesty and integrity of the FiF constituency, on this matter; and others.

Posted by Laurence Roberts at Saturday, 7 July 2012 at 7:41pm BST

Bp Rowell: "We ask, too, for that proper respect for conscience which will continue to allow all traditions in our Church to flourish without detriment to one another."

I'm sorry, but "No Girls Allowed" is a discriminatory *policy*, not a "tradition" [Whereas Anglo-Catholicism IS a tradition, and one that has shown itself perfectly compatible w/ recognizing women in ALL holy orders!]

Posted by JCF at Saturday, 7 July 2012 at 9:09pm BST

The letter to The Times is an extraordinarily well-crafted expression of the position of those bishops who are unable to accept the ministry of women priests and potential women bishops. It is utterly reasonable, and inclusive of the conservative Evangelical tradition which (I think) none of the signatories represents. Maybe this tradition has no such bishops, which is interesting in itself; or maybe they were not asked if they would like to sign, which is a curious way of living 'Better Together' which is a recent Anglo-Catholic initiative. A notable non-signatory is the Bishop of London.

That said, I cannot get my head round why at least some of these bishops are (and have been in the past) content to ordain women to the diaconate who aspire to become priests; and who then license them to serve - as what? - in their dioceses. It's like wilfully leading them up to the altar, only to abandon them there, like jilted brides. The only way round this (it seems to me) is that they equate them with various dysfunctional male (and female) clergy that they are stuck with.

But the reasonableness of this letter is far from some of the cries from the grass (or maybe GRAS) roots of each side: some claiming taint as bad as Original Sin, and others inflating the issue to include moral injustice being heaped on all womankind.

Much as I favour the legitimate equality of all bishops, male and female, I do think the moment has absolutely come for accepting an all-male provision through the PEVs, and just a touch more flexibility from some of the more political voices in favour.

A recent news item suggests that, for the first time, the C of E's inequality practice may just be thrown out during the Parliamentary process. I don't think the bishops - whoever they are - are fools. What would indeed be foolish is to push so hard for a political principle that the pastoral end-product disappears in the process. Many of the dioceses pressed for, and agreed, following motions for the provision of those opposed. Let's go for what might be possible now, rather than risk more years of agonising over this. Not that anyone in York will be reading Thinking Anglicans...

Posted by Peter Edwards at Saturday, 7 July 2012 at 11:36pm BST

Within the Anglican Communion there are 3 Provincial Churches holding their General Synod Meetings at this time: The Church of England; The Episcopal Church of the USA; and the Anglican Church in Aoteroa/New Zealand and Pasefeka, in Fiji.

My prayer for each of these meetings is that God's purposes may be fulfilled - through the acceptance of Justice for ALL. Jesu, mercy; Mary, pray!

Posted by Father Ron Smith at Sunday, 8 July 2012 at 7:02am BST

welcome to Professor Diarmaid MacCulloch's article.It's good to have input from a classical Church Historian on a subject dear to the hearts of many of us in the world-wide Anglican Communion.

The fact that the Ministry of Women is actually celebrated in the history of the Early Church is so often disregarded by those who would maintain the partiarchal tradition. Let's hope the Church of England's General Synod will be able to jump the intellectual hurdle this time around.

Posted by Father Ron Smith at Sunday, 8 July 2012 at 11:15am BST

"Women bishops must be given full powers, MPs warn
A group of MPs is threatening to overrule the Church of England unless it agrees full-scale implementation of women bishops. Citing the bishops’ warning that government proposals to legalise same-sex marriage threatened the established role of the Church, Mr Bradshaw said establishment was a “two-way relationship”. "

Posted by Randal Oulton at Sunday, 8 July 2012 at 11:51am BST

There are only two bishops of any consequence signing the times letter, Europe and Chichester. Blackburn is about to retire and the others are suffragans and flying bishops. They represent few parishes and certainly Chichester does not represent his diocese (don't forget that Chichester has voted FOR women bishops, it voted against the legislation by surprisingly narrow majorities.) Their theology is defective, the issue of 'headship' is rissible in this day and age and by ordaaining deacons and inducting women they seem to be conniving in placing women in positions of authority whose sacramental ministry they don't acknowledge and thus, surely in their own eyes, depriving parishes and people. Isn't this duplicitous at best, dishonest at worst?

Posted by Richard Ashby at Sunday, 8 July 2012 at 7:09pm BST

I notice that the number of priests ordained by the PEV's in this weeks Church Times is quite small. Of course there are only 400 and something ABC parishes but the number of male priests being ordained each year who have an "impecable" pedigree is shrinking so one wonders about deployment in the future.Does anyone know how many ABC parishes there were in,say, 1995? I wonder if many parishes have rescinded resolution C ( or indeed any of the others) when the incumbent in place in 1992 has left or retired.Something for those who run that instructive website British Religion in Numbers( BRIN)

Posted by Perry Butler at Sunday, 8 July 2012 at 9:29pm BST
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