Comments: Women Bishops: Enough Waiting

"My hope for next month’s debate is that it will tackle what is really before us, not what it is assumed or even suspected to mean"

Isn't that the problem, that the wording is such that people can read a number of meanings into it? It probably must be so, otherwise you'd never get agreement.

But it would help if
a. the legal meaning of "Respect" was spelled out clearly and
b. someone explained what the HoB "meant" so that the rest of us can stop speculating.
c. someone legally trained explained the scope of the wording regardless of what the HoB "meant", but the way it can legally be interpreted once it has been passed.

Posted by Erika Baker at Friday, 19 October 2012 at 12:45pm BST

Wonderful!

Posted by Alastair Newman at Friday, 19 October 2012 at 1:21pm BST

Could it be that, after his recent exposure to the Roman Catholic Synod of Bishops, ++Rowan has come to realise the infinite gulf there is between our two Churches on the Faith and Order consequences of Women's Ordination?

Despite the good relationship that exists between the Pope and this Archbishop of Canterbury, it must now be recognised that the prospect of any immediate convergence on the ministry of women in our respective Churches must seem as far away as ever.

Whatever the reason for ++Rowan's turnaround on
the urgency of the need For General Synod's vote, that would enable the Draft Measure to go forward, I am one person that applauds his decision to urge the members of G.S. to pass the legislation.

The rationale for this follow-up to the previous legislation that allowed women to become Priests in the Church ought, surely, to convince even the conservatives among us to take the plunge, and to go ahead with the Ordination of Women Bishops in the Church of England. The consequences of such a measure would help rid the Church of any thought of misogyny that might still obscure the fact that Women, as well as Men, are bearers of the Image and likeness of the Christ we serve.

This sounds more like the Rowan we once knew - an advocate of our commonality in Christ. Deo gratias

Posted by Father Ron Smith at Saturday, 20 October 2012 at 1:02am BST

Fr Ron Smith,

You're right, this is more like the Rowan we once knew and loved.

But why the shift to speaking his mind at last? Perhaps he's demob happy, after all he has little to lose now and everything to gain from snatching one major achievement at the very end of his archiepiscopate.

It'll be interesting to read what he writes once he's safely back in academia in Cambridge next year and free from the burdens of trying (fruitlessly) to appease conservative factions in the Anglican Communion. Will he then revert for example to his original views on the gay issue?

Posted by Concerned Anglican at Saturday, 20 October 2012 at 10:53pm BST

Even if the current Measure is passed. there will still be years of internal wrangling and dissension. Traditionalists who remain in the Church of england, I imagine, will simply not comply. Conscience will not be overriden.

Posted by Benedict at Sunday, 21 October 2012 at 12:34pm BST

The stuff about "the Rowan we once knew" is nonsense. He has always been utterly committed to women bishops and utterly committed to provision for those opposed.

We really don't do this stuff the way other Provinces do. Rowan has been consistent on trying to keep the opponents in and trying to get the legislation through. People on TA may not get the nuances of the debate (hence we get people on threads like these deploring the "fact" that we've sold opponents down the river and others deploring the "fact" that we've made provision for people whose views shouldn't be countenanced). Which probably means we've got it about right.

A lot of us will now be seeking to argue for that 2/3 majority in the face of some folk from both ends who are discomforted and feel that they can't vote for it. Rowan (and the vast majority of the rest of the House of Bishops) will be strong advocates for the legislation. The alternative (that it fails and we have to wait for women bishops - and that it comes back as a one clause measure with no provision at all) simply shouldn't be contemplated.

Posted by Pete Broadbent at Sunday, 21 October 2012 at 2:30pm BST

Peter Broadbent said, "We really don't do this stuff the way other Provinces do."

And you think that's a virtue?

The current tendency to try to have it both ways may prove counterproductive and self-defeating.

Mark my words. The C of E will eventually need to resort to a strong doctrinal line in favor of women's ordination.

And when it happens, the rest of the country will applaud.

Most of modern society, after all, is wondering what is taking the C of E so long, and why the Church of England is bending over backwards to accommodate troglodytes.

Meanwhile the Anglican brand is damaged immeasurably.

Posted by Jeremy at Tuesday, 23 October 2012 at 3:58am BST

"Conscience will not be overriden." - Benedict -

Which meme applies to both parties - whether for or against the Ordination of women Bishops. Justice cries out to be heard.

Posted by Father Ron Smith at Tuesday, 23 October 2012 at 10:11am BST
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