Comments: More on that CofE marriage report

Ah, the fantasies of persecution dreamed up by conservative Christian clergy. I wish we might put the emphasis where it belongs:

An EU survey out today reports one in five European GLBT people have been victimized by homophobic attacks or violent threats in the past five years: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-22563843

And meanwhile, in Georgia (the one in the Caucasus), a clergy-led mob violently disrupted a gay rights parade. Thirty people were injured. http://en.ria.ru/world/20130517/181207800.html

That's persecution!

Posted by Charlotte at Friday, 17 May 2013 at 6:28pm BST

"The rapid campaign to sideline and silence it by opponents is an illuminating and worrying sign of where things may be headed in the Church of England."

"Worrying" for YOU, Mr Goddard. For (ahem) Thinking Anglicans, the aforementioned campaign is a sign the CofE ain't dead yet!

Posted by JCF at Saturday, 18 May 2013 at 3:43am BST

Thanks Charlotte, for the reminder of what real persecution looks like. There's also not having your full human rights, losing employment, being barred from the hospital bedside of one's life-long partner, depression, etc.

Posted by Cynthia at Saturday, 18 May 2013 at 4:46am BST

While Stephen Bates has dug out some new and interesting information, Andrew Goddard has not.

Still, you have to admire Andrew's solitary defence of this deeply flawed document. He shows loyalty and is unconcerned at the impact on his own reputation and credibility.

Everyone I have read criticises the document specifically and with just cause. It does not do well what it was intended to do.

He is right when he calls on those who are not believers in a flat earth to come out and tell us more. If the document failed to reflect what we now understand to be true, then we need more scholars to speak up. Equal marriage is about to happen, the Church needs to have something better to say than "it just cannot be!", and to try and protect itself from successful legal challenge. It is arguing itself into a deeper hole and a smaller corner, while God (as ever) seems to be inhabiting the real world and enlivening real people and real sacramental relationships.

So while I understand the call to ignore the Commission's thinking because it adds nothing new (that was its brief!), we need to do much more so that our faith and message does not become ever more profoundly irrelevant to the world it came to set free.

I have helped place children born to married couples whose lives had been destroyed and seen them resurrected, transformed and restored by the love of same sex families. Those of us who have adopted or have been adopted should find within Christianity THE DEEPEST understanding and theological support for our families. In the most perverse way and for the most perverse reasons, the Church continues to do us great harm.

Posted by Martin Reynolds at Saturday, 18 May 2013 at 9:13am BST

I am just petrified by the rise of homophobic violence in New York, Paris, Russia, where bishops, far from defending their persecuted flock, are fanning the flames. The selfrighteousness of homophobic Anglican clergymen chills me, but happily they are a minority.

Posted by Spirit of Vatican II at Sunday, 19 May 2013 at 5:56am BST

"I am just petrified by the rise of homophobic violence in New York, Paris, Russia, where bishops, far from defending their persecuted flock, are fanning the flames."

Spirit, I'm wondering if there really is a rise in homophobic violence, or if people are starting to report it for what it is? There has been an awful lot of hate related violence here in the US for a very long time. I suspect that now that a majority believe in human rights for LGBT persons, that the hate crimes are reported as such, rather than as a random assault.

Religion has long fanned these flames, much to their shame. Praise God for a sea change. The moral arc of the universe bends slowly, but it bends toward justice. As I was contemplating these issues (relative to my recent Civil Union), a double rainbow appeared in the Colorado sky. That New Zealand MP would have even more to wax poetic over!

Posted by Cynthia at Sunday, 19 May 2013 at 9:32pm BST
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