Comments: Primate says Kenya will not attend ACC-16 in Lusaka

"How these Christians do hate each other." Or am I remembering it wrong? I do remember the bit about Jesus refusing to eat with sinners and tax gatherers, though.

Posted by Nathaniel Brown at Thursday, 10 March 2016 at 8:25pm GMT

“Let him go, let him tarry, let him sink or let him swim. He doesn’t care for me and I don’t care for him” The only question is how many others will swim along with Kenya and Uganda? Honesty should have dictated the way forward! Agree where we can and live as best we can with difference, the original plan for the meeting. This whole “Meeting of Primate” has become a shameful sham.

Posted by Fr Paul D Dean at Thursday, 10 March 2016 at 8:45pm GMT

Another bunch homophobes walk off in a sulk. Good riddance.

Sooner they set up their own communion, the better.

Posted by James Byron at Thursday, 10 March 2016 at 9:13pm GMT

There are only two ways of looking at this. The proposed non-attendance is either childish hubris or the result of pressure from American schismatics.

Posted by Nicholas Henderson at Thursday, 10 March 2016 at 10:18pm GMT

'There are only two ways of looking at this. The proposed non-attendance is either childish hubris or the result of pressure from American schismatics.'

Well, I'm sure it makes you feel good to say that. However, there is a third possibility: that they genuinely believe they are being obedient to the will of God.

Posted by Tim Chesterton at Friday, 11 March 2016 at 3:47am GMT

"This defiance of the Primates’ moral and spiritual authority."

It is good that he acknowledges that the Primates had no legal authority in the matter. Whether they have moral or spiritual authority is surely in the eye of the beholder. Many of us believe the contrary.

Sad that the fudge in January may have put negative pressure on the Canadian Anglican Church and other provinces.

Posted by Iain Baxter at Friday, 11 March 2016 at 6:17am GMT

"Another bunch homophobes walk off in a sulk. Good riddance.

Sooner they set up their own communion, the better."

Fine if you are an LGBT person in the West but if I was a Kenyan I would want my archbishop there and having to listen to TEC and would be praying his ears might be opened and his mind unblocked.

Posted by Kate at Friday, 11 March 2016 at 12:56pm GMT

Tim and Nicholas, it may well be a combination of all three, as they are not mutually exclusive.

Posted by Tobias Haller at Friday, 11 March 2016 at 2:47pm GMT

"The proposed non-attendance ... there is a third possibility: that they genuinely believe they are being obedient to the will of God."

From a fundamental point of view, regardless of the merits of the current controversy, I have a significant problem with that point of view.

Jesus spent a lot of time with the unrighteous to the point of being accused of being a glutton, a drunkard, and a friend of tax collectors and sinners.

Jesus's response was that he had come to call not the righteous, but the sinners.

Jesus calls us, not to wait until the sinners are righteous enough to come to us, but for us to go out to the sinners.

If Archbishop Wabukala believes TEC is a sinner, then he should come to the meeting to convince TEC of the errors of its way. Again, and again, and again. It simply does not do to wait until TEC becomes sufficiently righteous on its own.

Posted by dr.primrose at Friday, 11 March 2016 at 8:13pm GMT

So far only African Archbishops are declaring interest not to attend the ACC meeting in Zambia. I feel so sad to say let them go and this boycott of important meeting/gathering is more of a western method than an African way of dealing with dispute. Recently I wrote to the Archbishop of Uganda
http://www.gaystarnews.com/article/you-need-to-read-this-christians-response-to-an-anti-gay-ugandan-archbishop/#gs.Z_grElk
The hold of America schismatics on our African bishops is the new dangerous slavery that needs to be dealt with.

Posted by Davis Mac-Iyalla at Friday, 11 March 2016 at 9:34pm GMT

Kate, it's rare that you can reason someone out of a position they've not been reasoned into. Kenyan bishops have heard all the affirming arguments, met LGBT people, and chosen to stick to their beliefs. If compassion or argument was likely to have moved them, it would've happened already. These aren't uneducated or unworldly men; they're simply men who're devoted to orthodox Christianity.

By trying to stay in the same club, you'll just retard progress in the West. Let them go their own way, offer asylum to any LGBT Kenyan who wants it, and we can, at long last, move past this impasse.

Posted by James Byron at Friday, 11 March 2016 at 10:00pm GMT

Tim, I'm pretty sure EVERY time someone engages in childish hubris, they "genuinely believe they are being obedient to the will of God" [I mean, did anyone ever think, "I'm going to engage in childish hubris now"?]

Posted by JCF at Saturday, 12 March 2016 at 9:58pm GMT

I dunno--I'm just not accustomed to Anglican bishops' being so foolish as to put themselves forward as having "moral and spiritual authority." Thinking of themselves that way has resulted in the humiliation of plenty of television evangelists. If they had any wisdom (to say nothing of humility) they'd think at least twice before so-describing themselves.

Posted by Daniel Berry, NYC at Sunday, 13 March 2016 at 9:28pm GMT

"'There are only two ways of looking at this. The proposed non-attendance is either childish hubris or the result of pressure from American schismatics.'

Well, I'm sure it makes you feel good to say that. However, there is a third possibility: that they genuinely believe they are being obedient to the will of God." - Posted by: Tim Chesterton -

Well, Tim, I hope that you are right - that the non-attenders really do feel they are doing God's will by staying away from ACC16 - because it certainly seems contrary to what everyone except ++Uganda indicated at the recent Primates' Conference. And. certainly contrary to the expressed will of Jesus in his prayer to the Father: "That they may be one, Father, as you and I are one". Schismatic action is a fearful thing.

Posted by Father Ron Smith at Wednesday, 16 March 2016 at 8:21am GMT

JCF said 'Tim, I'm pretty sure EVERY time someone engages in childish hubris, they "genuinely believe they are being obedient to the will of God"'

Undoubtedly. It does not follow, however, that every time a person genuinely believes they are being obedient to the will of God, they are actually engaging in childish hubris.

I have no window into other people's hearts, so I don't think i'm qualified to judge whether, on any particular occasion, hubris or a sincere desire to please God is the dominant motivation. So I repeat that to say this is either hubris or the result of being duped by American schismatics is overly simplistic.

Posted by Tim Chesterton at Monday, 21 March 2016 at 8:25pm GMT
Post a comment









Remember personal info?






Please note that comments are limited to 400 words. Comments that are longer than 400 words will not be approved.

Cookies are used to remember your personal information between visits to the site. This information is stored on your computer and used to refill the text boxes on your next visit. Any cookie is deleted if you select 'No'. By ticking 'Yes' you agree to this use of a cookie by this site. No third-party cookies are used, and cookies are not used for analytical, advertising, or other purposes.