Thinking Anglicans

two reports from Battersea Rise

The Church Times has Battersea vicar causes stir by remarks about Global South by Rachel Harden.

A VICAR of a south-London parish where one of the Church of England’s most senior officials is a Reader explained this week why he asked for the tape-recording system to be turned off at the end of a Sunday service so that he could talk about supporting the Global South.

The Revd Paul Perkin, Vicar of St Mark’s, Battersea Rise, in Southwark diocese, and a member of the General Synod, said that he believed his remarks would be taken out of context if they were recorded and repeated…

The Church of England Newspaper has “We Have Renounced Secret Ways”…But Have We? by Simon Butler.

In South London recently, a prominent Evangelical minister asked that the microphones and recording equipment in his church be switched off. To a hushed congregation he announced that, with a split in the Anglican Communion imminent, his church would need to decide with who they were going to ‘sit’. This, he said, was to have particular implications for the finances of the church, which may need to be redirected towards the ‘Global South’. He asked his congregation to trust his lead on this matter. Consultation was clearly not on the agenda…

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Pluralist
15 years ago

The secret ways article of Revd. Simon Butler is most interesting, as is observing movements in some parts of evangelicalism. It is interesting observing the progress of open evangelicalism and all the postmodern and post-evangelical moves. It has recently been defined again (in Bradford) as doctrine at the centre and policing that rather than the whole gathering; it also involves strategies of going out into the community and being a new form of church. I mention Bradford because it is the home of that vacuum cleaner of churches, Abundant Life Church, with its huge media centre for a church and… Read more »

J. C. Fisher
J. C. Fisher
15 years ago

I think the most disturbing thing about this incident (“Chapman Memo”-esque, on the other side of The Pond?) is this bit from Rev. Perkins: “we must support the Global South financially, as they were losing funding from North America.” If he is speaking of TEC, to the best of my knowledge there has been NO reduction in funding to Global South Anglicans, or to any specific entity among them. Even as conservatives in TEC play politics with *their* financial support, TEC (as expressed in GC’s outreach budget) has not. ***** This is an outstanding observation by Rev. Simon Butler: “I… Read more »

Cynthia Gilliatt
Cynthia Gilliatt
15 years ago

I will echo the observation that funding from TEC has not been withdrawn, but in some places rejected. In other places, it has been welcomed. The Diocese of Virginia continues – in very difficult circumstances – to support the Diocese of Renk in Sudan, with both money and people. But I have not recently heard of any statements by ++Akinola about Sudan – just about his raising money for a giant delegation to Lambeth. Nor have I heard of his involvment in working to help the horrific situation of Lagos, recently described in an article in The New Yorker. Instead,… Read more »

Göran Koch-Swahne
15 years ago

Simon Butler writes in his article: “I am one of those evangelicals who is constantly drawn to what might be called evangelical essentials, but who, since ordination, has never ministered in the evangelical subculture. I don’t go to the big conferences; I don’t just read the ‘approved’ authors; and I see the Church of England as much more than ‘the best boat to fish from’.”

Didn’t we use to call this kind of thing something or other?

5th something…

Alan Marsh
Alan Marsh
15 years ago

How many bishops would TEC like to send to Lambeth 2008? (If it is invited. Will they come even if VGR is not invited?)

J. C. Fisher
J. C. Fisher
15 years ago

Though I don’t quite see the relevance of your question Alan M, the answer is quite simple: ***ALL*** of TEC’s diocesan bishops should (and, I believe, WILL) attend Lambeth. Period.

[No Ifs, Ands, or “Seems +NewHampshire’s invite got lost in the mail?” Buts!!! ;-p]

Alan Marsh
Alan Marsh
15 years ago

I was just comparing numbers in the light of Cynthia’s posting. If Nigeria sends the same number of bishops to represent its membership, pro rata with those of TEC, then it will require rather a large number of planeloads.

Göran Koch-Swahne
15 years ago

You are always talking of numbers, Alan.

As if numbers mattered.

Christopher Shell
Christopher Shell
15 years ago

Good for PP for speaking out the truth as he sees it, without regard to fashion and trends. But the turning off of the mikes was wrong if he really believes in openness. (It was also pointless, as plenty of people would be able to report that the mikes were turned off). There is a danger of exhibiting a controversialist spirit.

Alan Marsh
Alan Marsh
15 years ago

Actually Goran it was Cynthia who was rather concerned about numbers – of Nigerian bishops attending Lambeth 2008.

In practice it is ECUSA which is always vastly over-represented in relation to its actual size. But I rather think it will only be attending the next Lambeth via video-link, if at all.

Merseymike
Merseymike
15 years ago

Given the level of intellectual or remotely relevant activity likely to take place there, I think they should save their money and let the fanatics get on with it. Let them enjoy their delusions in peace

Jerry Hannon
Jerry Hannon
15 years ago

Alan Marsh wrote “In practice it is ECUSA which is always vastly over-represented in relation to its actual size. But I rather think it will only be attending the next Lambeth via video-link, if at all.” The reality is that neither numbers, nor wealth, matters. And, as to how many bishops come from Nigeria, or USA, or England, or Antarctica, have we really gotten to the point where we will have a litmus test of direct correlation of numbers of bishops to the numbers of “members” of their national churches? What nonsense. Mr. Marsh is entitled to his opinion, just… Read more »

Alan Marsh
Alan Marsh
15 years ago

Actually Jerry it was Cynthia who was rather concerned about numbers – of Nigerian bishops attending Lambeth 2008…..

Given the growing trend towards a synodical style of Lambeth meeting, it would be rather more democratic for the numbers attending, representing their churches, to have some correlation to the size of their membership, as opposed to their bank balances.

But I detect a certain irritation in some ECUSA quarters that the power of the dollar seems to have ebbed somewhat in the global Anglican communion. How sad to join Britain as a former colonial power!

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