Thinking Anglicans

yet another group of bishops

Updated Saturday

The Anglican Communion Office has issued this statement:

Following consultation with the Presiding Bishop the Archbishop of Canterbury has asked Bishop Peter Lee of Virginia and Bishop John Lipscomb of Southwest Florida to convene a small group of bishops from the Episcopal Church (USA) to meet together to discuss some of the difficult issues facing the Church and to explore possible resolutions. Along with Bishop Griswold, those invited include Bishop Katharine Jefferts Schori, Bishop Bob Duncan, and Bishop Jack Iker . The Secretary General of the Anglican Communion will also attend. The first meeting will be taking place in New York in the first half of September.

Update
This statement from Bishop Jack Iker indicates that others will be attending: including Bishops Salmon (South Carolina, retired but now acting bishop until the new election occurs) and Stanton (Dallas):

…In accordance with the Archbishop’s instructions, we are each to bring along another Bishop to share in these deliberations, and we have asked Bishop Ed Salmon of South Carolina and Bishop James Stanton of Dallas to join us. All four of us are member Bishops in the Anglican Communion Network and our dioceses have requested alternative primatial oversight from the Archbishop of Canterbury.

We are grateful to the Archbishop of Canterbury for his efforts to broker a cease fire in our current conflicts and to assist us in finding a way to work through the impasse we have reached. If things go well at this initial meeting, additional dates have been set aside to continue our deliberations in the future. Your prayers are asked for the participants as we seek a way forward for a church in crisis.

Update
Episcopal News Service has issued this news report by Mary Frances Schjonberg Communion representative to confer with some Episcopal Church bishops:

…The meeting has been in the works since the Episcopal Church’s 75th General Convention in June, according to Canon James M Rosenthal, director of communications in the Anglican Communion Office.

The Secretary General of the Anglican Communion, the Rev. Canon Kenneth Kearon, attended the convention. At the time he commended the Episcopal Church for the “very careful way they have taken seriously the requests of the Windsor Report, and you see this seriousness in the way that business is being conducted on this particular issue at Convention.”

Rosenthal said that Kearon will be “facilitating” the meeting in September.

He added that the Anglican Communion Office is a “very proper and appropriate place to begin” a conversation of this importance.

“The Anglican Communion Office has been responsible for many of the meetings and committees that have been given the portfolio for concerns of church unity in the midst of our diversity,” Rosenthal said. “This meeting could well be an important step in that continuing work…”

Update
Rachel Zoll of Associated Press managed to speak to Bishop Lee:

…Virginia Bishop Peter Lee, who is among the six U.S. invitees, said the participants “have agreed not to talk at length with the press” about the gathering.

“The archbishop of Canterbury is encouraging American bishops to try to work on these questions,” Lee said in a phone interview. “We’re trying to hold together people who have differing views and to respect those differing views.”

Update Saturday
The Living Church has a report: Bishop Iker: Bishops’ Summit May Provide Clarity:

“Obviously I have my reservations about how productive a meeting like this can be,” Bishop Iker told The Living Church. “I think it is significant that I have heard nothing from either the Presiding Bishop or Katharine Jefferts Schori since General Convention. To me this indicates that he [Archbishop Williams] is trying to respond to a pastoral situation and they are trying as hard as they can to ignore it.”

Bishop Iker said he was first contacted by Lambeth Palace more than two weeks ago and asked if he would be willing to participate in a meeting designed to “facilitate a solution” to the current controversy and division within The Episcopal Church and the Anglican Communion. In addition to bishops Iker, Lee and Lipscomb, invitations to the mid-September meeting in New York have been extended to Pittsburgh Bishop Robert Duncan, Dallas Bishop James Stanton, the Rt. Rev. Edward L. Salmon, Jr., acting Bishop of South Carolina, and the Rt. Rev. Don E. Wimberly, Bishop of Texas.

Bishop Wimberly previously called for a consultation in Texas of all bishops who are willing to stand firmly with the recommendations of the Windsor Report. The consultation is scheduled to begin after the meeting in New York City.

“Four of the seven bishops who asked for APO will be there,” Bishop Iker said. “I believe everyone should see the consolidated APO request before the meeting and I would hope we could come away with a clear statement of what APO should look like as well as an assurance that it will be provided.”

The Diocese of Southwest Florida has two related reports:Bishop: Ties to American church, Canterbury to remain and High-level meeting called to discuss resolutions to ‘difficult issues’

31
Leave a Reply

avatar
3000
31 Comment threads
0 Thread replies
0 Followers
 
Most reacted comment
Hottest comment thread
20 Comment authors
Simon SarmientoJimTobias HallerGöran Koch-SwahneCheryl Clough Recent comment authors
  Subscribe  
newest oldest
Notify of
John Robison
Guest
John Robison

Well. I wonder what on earth that little group is going to talk about. I mean Will +Iker even acknowledge the presence of one of those subhuman women clergy in the same room with him? Both he and +Duncan have made their positions perfectly clear. This is a stupid waste of time dressed up as a “dialog.” When are we going to learn that these little sessions aren’t worth it? This will allow +Cantuar to say he tried to lead, but doesn’t require him to actually do so.

Marshall Scott
Guest

Well, this should certainly be interesting. One can’t say that the spectrum is not represented. Can the Archbishop mandate such a meeting? No; and he’s said so elsewhere. Can he request such a meeting? Yes; and we’re wise to cooperate, rather than to get our backs up. And what of the participation of Canon Kearon? As Secretary General of the Anglican Communion and of the Anglican Consultative Council, this suggests a broader perspective than two English bishops going to Texas, however qualified and however “blessed” by the Archbishop himself. So, not only is the “Focus of Unity” represented, but also… Read more »

Pete
Guest
Pete

Does Rowan Williams wake up every day and ask: “How can I create chaos in the Anglican Communion today?” Because he’s done it…again. What can possibly be the purpose of this meeting? We all know where Duncan and Iker stand. Is Iker going to sit on the other side of the room and direct comments to Jefferts-Schori through a third-party since he doesn’t recognize her as either a priest or bishop? Will Duncan sneak out to call Akinola on his cell phone for directions? Why does Williams continue to meddle in the Episcopal Church, but ignore the nonsense going on… Read more »

J. C. Fisher
Guest
J. C. Fisher

Well, at least this sounds far more “official”, than that group meeting at Camp Allen…

I pray the Holy Spirit enlightens all gathered there.

Leonardo Ricardo
Guest
Leonardo Ricardo

Why not invite Bishop V.G. Robinson too and really “talk turkey” with these scheming, behind-the-scenes, underminding Episcopal Church/Anglican Communion renigades OPENLY? Let’s have it on videotape! Are they brave enough even with +++Rowan request/encouragement to finally look at the REAL “reasons” for their prejudice/hate in the face-to-face meeting? No more packing up and running out of the room when +V.G.Robinson or ++Jefferts-Schori is about to speak (as Iker did at the GC2006). Let’s see who has enough basic maturity, integrity and personal accountability to sit together once again and pray for healthy outcomes for the Episcopal Church and the Anglican… Read more »

Cynthia Gilliatt
Guest
Cynthia Gilliatt

Will they try and share Eucharist?

Let’s see – not if the PB presides, because his hands touched +Gene.

Not if the PB-Elect presides, because she has female hands.

Not if Bp Lee presides, because although he did not lay hands on +Gene, he voted for him.

Funnily enough, all three of the above would be perfectly happy for any of the others to preside.

Prior Aelred
Guest

The lineup hardly seems to a balanced representation — is the purpose to have the elected leaders of the church be scolded by the dissidents (with Lee unsure of where he stands)? Balance would seem to require some progressive representation (& please bear in mind that +(+) Katharine was NOT the most progressive candidate on the slate — nor was ++Frank in 1998).

And it certainly is disappointing that the AC Office has not troubled to spell the PB-elect’s name correctly.

Martin Reynolds
Guest

I get a little frustrated by some here, who I assume are members of TEC, protesting at the Rowan Williams sticking his nose in to their affairs. Might I suggest that your protest should be aimed at your own Primate? Was it not he that signed the first Primates Statement protesting the ordination of Gene Robinson, and later the Dromantine Communiqué? Has he not been party to all these developments and lent his considerable weight to the belief that this (hitherto) “boys club” has some overarching or enhanced responsibility for or governance of the member churches of the Anglican Communion?… Read more »

Davis d'Ambly
Guest
Davis d'Ambly

This is the first positive news I’ve read in weeks.

Cheryl Clough
Guest

The only consoling comment I can think of at this time is that this was inevitable. There is no way the intolerant could allow the liberals to keep making progress without making a stand at some point. Again, the issue will be whether the intolerant will allow diversity: or will they continue to raid, sabotage and/or slander every liberal church that tries to get itself established. For me, the bigger issue is that there are souls out there who want to have a closer relationship with God through Jesus, but who refuse to turn their backs on their friends and… Read more »

marc
Guest
marc

I think it’s remarkable that these folks are willing to actually sit at the same table with one another in a forum like this. I wonder if any ground rules have been suggested by the ABC or agreed upon by those gathering. If the quote (above) from Bp Iker was accurate, it sounds to me like he’s coming in with a predetermined agenda with the intent of monopolizing their time and so, like their tactics regarding GenCon/WR, leaving no possibility for the outcome to be anything but a failure.

Tom R
Guest
Tom R

I do not have high hopes for this meeting. It is obviously an attempt at mediation connected with consideration of the petitions from +Duncan, +Iker, et. al. for alternative primatial oversight. From +Duncan’s statements, I doubt that he would agree to any arrangment that did not include a commitment to work towards the establishment of a non-geographical, ideologically-based province within TEC with which any TEC congregation could affiliate. I don’t think that any such arrangment will, or should, be acceptable to the larger TEC. The whole matter of APO will land back in Lambeth Palace.

Cynthia Gilliatt
Guest
Cynthia Gilliatt

“I think it is significant that I have heard nothing from either the Presiding Bishop or Katharine Jefferts Schori since General Convention.” Why should he have heard from them? Is he supposed to be catered to because gencon did not make decisions pleasing to him? It made some not pleasing to progressives, but I don’t see them whining about not having their hands held. It looks to me again like the ABC wringing his hands and trying to appease a pack of bullies. It doesn’t work on the playground and it won’t work with purple shirts and pointy hats, either.… Read more »

Leonardo Ricardo
Guest
Leonardo Ricardo

Greetings from the “inclusive and loving” Province of Central America on a gorgeous “eternal Spring” morning!

Bishop Iker has already published that the “two Bishops Meetings” will come together as “one mind” and that Wimberly is invited to the New York Meeting also. Scroll down at this “link” and read the two “posts” by Iker…these “meetings” are more “defined” than we’ve been told unless Iker is simply continuing to think/do things “his way or the highway!”

http://www.standfirminfaith.com/index.php/site/article/1052/

Kendall Harmon
Guest

Bishop Salmon is NOT retired. He is serving as acting bishop of South Carolina with the Standing Committee as the canonical authority. Bishop Salmon hopes to retire next year after the transition to new episcopal leadership is helpfully established.

Tobias S Haller BSG
Guest
Tobias S Haller BSG

It seems to me that, like it or not, any kind of Alternative Primatial Oversight will have to involve change or adaptation in the legal structures of the Episcopal Church — whether that means the creation of a new non-geographical Province X, a “flying bishops” scheme, or some other mechanism. I know similar ideas have been tabled and rejected in the past; but that does not mean that they cannot be reconsidered — as we saw at General Convention, reconsideration might be considered an Anglican conceptual art-form. (Along with improvisation, another art-form it seems Anglicans have been taking up of… Read more »

Martin Reynolds
Guest

“like it or not, any kind of Alternative Primatial Oversight will have to involve change or adaptation in the legal structures of the Episcopal Church”
This should be easy – after all General Convention has abandoned its “prophetic” position leaving its lesbian and gay clergy vulnerable, Gene Robinson in particular.

Dave
Guest
Dave

Let’s hope and pray that we are finally seeing some acceptance that the “issues” really are too great to ignore; or to pretend that they are just secondary issues, and that people should “just get over it”.

I’ve really enjoyed debating this with folk here over the last few years, and developed quite a soft spot for many people who I disagree strongly with. But have to sign off for the time being 🙁 ….. I will be praying.

“The grace of the Lord be with you all”.

Dave.

J. C. Fisher
Guest
J. C. Fisher

“I think it is significant that I have heard nothing from either the Presiding Bishop or Katharine Jefferts Schori since General Convention.”

What’s significant, is that +Iker can’t even be bothered to refer to the Presiding Bishop-Elect by her proper title. 🙁

I continue to pray for a miracle…

Leonardo Ricardo
Guest
Leonardo Ricardo

“The grace of the Lord be with you all”.

Dave.

…and with you too Dave. Amen

Marshall Scott
Guest

With all due respect, Tobias, I don’t see how any form of APO can function “in the legal structures of the Episcopal Church,” however changed or adapted. The level of oversight that Network congregations have requested in alternative episcopal oversight has been essentially disassociation – independence of the official diocese on financial support, program support, and deployment and ordination. Any “10th province” that had that level of “oversight” – independence of General Convention, of support for the national church, of canons and other standards for ordination, of communion with provinces within the Communion – would functionally be an extension of… Read more »

Cynthia Gilliatt
Guest
Cynthia Gilliatt

“It seems to me that, like it or not, any kind of Alternative Primatial Oversight will have to involve change or adaptation in the legal structures of the Episcopal …Any official changes will require the official participation of the acknowledged authorities: and whether the dissidents like it or not, the Presiding Bishop is the Presiding Bishop, the General Convention is the General Convention, and it is high time for the Archbishop to work to engage the dissidents with the legal authorities whose consent will be required for any legitimate (i.e., licit) adaptations to accommodate dissent.” And good luck to him.… Read more »

Obadiahslope
Guest
Obadiahslope

Cynthia, “Our dissadent minority should either stay and try to change things via our polity or they should just leave, and if that means leaving property and pension fund, so be it. That would be acting with integrity. I’ve not seen much of that from them.” Can I suggest a quick surf to http://theamia.org/ ? There you will find details of their congregations. The vast majority have left property behind – and depending on the terms of their pension fund – that too. If you want to find a number of people who have left TEC under the terms you… Read more »

Tobias S Haller BSG
Guest
Tobias S Haller BSG

Thank you Marshall, for the comment on the canonical issue, and Cynthia for that on the “dissidency.” On the latter, I agree in principle, and that is what I would do: if GC passed a canon with which I could not live, I would renounce my orders and go elsewhere. But I have long ago given up telling other folks what to do — they usually don’t, in spite of my good advice! ;-). So the issue for me is the practical one. How do we deal with the present state of affairs, and whiat might come out of this… Read more »

David Huff
Guest
David Huff

Br. Tobias,

That was an interesting suggestion RE: how “we might see old dioceses that were divided reextend their influence over formerly ceded territory, while the Network folks there form their non-geographic diocese / province.”

But what shall we do with Fort Worth, which was formed from part of Dallas ? Neither of these dioceses show much tolerance or generosity for anything or anyone approaching mainstream Episcopalianism…

Pete
Guest
Pete

Can we “bottom line” this thing. This is about a group of people who want to roll back the church to the 1950s, and want gays back in the closet because of the “ick” factor. Everything else–all the posturing, cries of orthodoxy, using Lambeth and the ABC for cover, etc., is nothing more then a group–maybe 10% of TEC–who know that if that split off they’ll end up as relevant as AMiA and the Reformed Episcopal Church. In other words, irrelevant. So, they want to steal the property and other goodies, get the ABC to recognize them, and then claim… Read more »

Cheryl Clough
Guest

Dave

May God watch over you while you are away. You and I might have had some interesting exchanges, but I have always been grateful for your honesty because it enabled healing to happen that would not have been possible without your forthright contributions. I shall miss you.

Göran Koch-Swahne
Guest

Let the Networkers keep San Joaquín and may the Episcopal Majority go back to the Diocese of California.

Wouldn’t that be Salmonic?

Tobias Haller
Guest
Tobias Haller

Obviously, David, this would not be the solution for Dallas / Ft Worth. But what if a new missionary diocese for the “reappraisers” in those places were allowed to form and function as such? I just think we’ve been paralyzed by a limited number of apparent options; stupefied by a lack of creativity in response to real disagreements. Perhaps it is because I firmly believe that in 50 years all of this will have faded to a sad memory that I hope for a minimally destructive solution in the meantime. Today’s note from the PB coincides fairly much exactly with… Read more »

Jim
Guest
Jim

With Iker and others either claiming or implying that the ABC has ‘ordered’ this meeting, and with Iker pre-demanding APO as an outcome, this response from G K Cameron, Deputy Secretary General of the Anglican Communion Office to an inquiry about the meeting is instructive. It certainly resonates with the PB’s description of the genesis of the meeting. Here’s the link to the original posting: http://inchatatime.blogspot.com/2006/08/thus-spake-secretary-general.html And here’s the message quoted: “Thank you for your email. Its contents have been carefully noted. The meeting in September to which you refer has been convened precisely so that bishops who are asking… Read more »

Simon Sarmiento
Guest

Jim
That material is already reported in a later news item, see
http://www.thinkinganglicans.org.uk/archives/001882.html