Thinking Anglicans

Vancouver's Anglican dissidents lose property appeal

The Anglican Journal reports: Canada’s top court denies appeal to dissident Vancouver churches

Press releases:

New Westminster: Supreme Court Denies Leave to Appeal

Anglican Network in Canada: Congregations Evicted from their Church Buildings
http://www.anglicanessentials.ca/wordpress/index.php/2011/06/17/anic-news-release-supreme-court/

Letters:

Pastoral letter from the Bishop of New Westminster (pdf)

Letter from the Canadian primate to the Bishop of New Westminster (pdf)

Press reports:

Vancouver Sun Top court refuses to hear appeal over four parish properties

National Post Breakaway Anglicans lose last legal avenue to claim ownership of church buildings, land

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Rod GillisRobert ian WilliamsGeoffMalcolm French+Robert ian Williams Recent comment authors
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Father Ron Smith
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Father Ron Smith

Perhaps those of the ANiC in Canada who sought the affirmation of the State in their pursuit of legal ownership of Anglican Church OF Canada properties will now come to realise that schism does not pay. You cannot forsake the jursidiction of your former Church – in pursuit of antithetical idealism – and expect to retain the perquisites thereof. Perhaps this will teach a valuable lesson to those of conservative tendencies in the Church who take the law into their own hands in demanding rights to property that is not, legally, theirs. There are right and wrong ways of solving… Read more »

robert ian williams
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robert ian williams

Without commenting on the justice of this.. the legal system in the Dominion of canada seems swifter and fairer than that in the rebel republic to the south.

Rod Gillis
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Rod Gillis

Re Robert Ian Williams, “Dominion ” of Canada. It’s just Canada –no need to use the word “dominion”.
July 1st is “Canada Day”–hasn’t been called “Dominion Day” in decades. My condolences on the death of Queen Victoria to you all.

Robert ian Williams
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Robert ian Williams

Yet Queen Elizabeth is Queen of Canada and her royal arms are to be seen in every Canadian court room. Canada is a realm and not a republic, and the monarchy is more popular than ever.

MarkBrunson
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Nor do we consider *ourselves* a rebel republic. My condolences on the death of George III.

Malcolm French+
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Without wanting to extend the thread drift too far, Robert Ian Williams yet again demonstrates that his parochialism leads him into an assortment of false assumptions and into a series of statements that are barely connected to reality. While most public opinion research indicates that Mrs. Battenburg herself is personally popular and well respected, there is scant evidence for RIW’s assertion that “the monarchy is more popular than ever” among Canadians. Apart from the odd uptick over a royal wedding or some such, the resounding Canadian attitude would better be described as benign neglect. The monarchy as effectively structured does… Read more »

Adam Armstrong
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Adam Armstrong

As a Canadian who cherishes the monarchy, I do not regret the loss of “Dominion Day”. It’s a word that no one ever uses (we used to have a supermarket chian by that name but it is long gone). “Canada Day” has become very popular and it doesn’t need translation into French. This year, the highlight of Canada Day on Parliament Hill be be the attendance of Prince William (Duke and Duchess of Cambridge) and last year the Queen was there, so there is no sense of trying to play down the British tie.

Rod Gillis
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Rod Gillis

Canada Day/ Fete Du Canada is not simply “very popular” as Adam Armstrong asserts, it is the official name of the 1st of July since our constitution was (finally!) repatriated from Westminster in 1982. I too I am old enough to remember “Dominion Day” and the old Red Ensign that was our flag before the introduction of the Maple Leaf that now proudly flies from my front porch.It is often accompanied there by the Stars and Stripes on American National holidays as a neighborly gesture. Although, on Friday it will be in the company of Quebec’s Fluer de lis because,… Read more »

MarkBrunson
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I think Rod has a valid point; one that I have previously suspected, strongly, but did not think of in my reply to RIW until he brought it up. The Covenant, the whole AC – as it stands – seems a last, desperate refuge for a dream of empire. I wonder, if the center, seat and focus of the AC were to be moved to one of the more moderate and less objectionable constituents – say, Canada or Mexico, or Japan – would this Covenant receive such heated and desperate backing from Lambeth? Perhaps, it should be suggested that, as… Read more »

Malcolm French+
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Rod, you may wish to consider adding the stylized Union Jack which is the official flag of Newfoundland and Labrador since St. John the Baptist is an official holiday on the Rock as well. As I mentioned before, the main obstacle to reconsidering the monarchy (besides the amending formula requirements) is the difficulty of replacing the current arrangement with something else – which was similarly the shoal on which Australian republicanism foundered. But I think you’re on to something with your reference to the so-called Anglican Covenant as the last vestige of the Victorian Age. Indeed, one might even say… Read more »

Robert ian Williams
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Robert ian Williams

All peripheral to my contention, that Justice under the Queen is far swifter in Canada.. look at the cases in America, manipulated by the schismatics and never ending.

Rod Gillis
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Rod Gillis

Robert Ian Williams, the notion about the comparative pace of “justice” in Canada v. the U.S. is a bit of an oversimplification. Some of the issues have to do with the differences around law in the two different federal systems. What is interesting to me is the persistence of the break away groups in chasing property claims against Anglican Church of Canada dioceses by means of a civil action in the courts. Their legal people should have seen this outcome a mile away based on precedent. Makes one wonder.

Rod Gillis
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Rod Gillis

Thanks to Mark Brunson and Malcolm French for their replies. Both use “empire/imperialism” in their reply. I agree. I’m quite serious about the politics of the proposed covenant as a mechanism grounded in an ecclessiology of a bygone era. Clearly, our Communion, like many of the countries and continents where it lives, is grappling with a post colonial situation. The dynamics of post colonialism i.e. who has power and who does not, and who is outraged at whom, are very much at play here. My dream for Anglicanism is that we would continue to evolve into a more conciliar church.… Read more »

Malcolm French+
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I agree that the so-called Covenant is “grounded in an ecclessiology of a bygone era.” Ironically, it is the very ecclessiology Anglicanism rejected at its birth. (Re: the monarchy – the amending formula isn’t the biggest problem. The problem is that the notional powers of the Crown are almost absolute. The powers are not exercised (except on advice) because the office lacks democratic legitimacy. Short of a complete constitutional rewrite, simply converting the appointed Governor General into an elected President would mean that the new office has democratic legitimacy and therefore has no reason not to exercise the full scope… Read more »

Rod Gillis
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Rod Gillis

A final word on the monarchy as a segue back into the discussion at hand about a post civil suit climate. You note several major problems confronting republicans in Canada. They are all solvable. It is within our power to declare independence and put in place a head of state that represents we the people or some such thing. The biggest obstacle Canada faces with regard to any kind of major negotiated social change is overcoming the grip that elites and elitism have on our country. Our social legacy remains, in English Canada, the legacy of the family compact. The… Read more »

Robert ian Williams
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Robert ian Williams

Take away the monarchy and Canada would split up and there would be no reason for not joining the rebel republic to the south. Seriously…. why is American justice so much slower..look at the Virginia/ Cana dispute?

Rod Gillis
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Rod Gillis

Robert Ian Williams, you really must come visit us (Canada and U.S.A.)sometime. You are the victim of misinformation from afar. I can assure you that the monarchy has nothing to do with Canadian unity. Now take away a beer production and we would be in trouble. There are significant differences between the two countries such as two different federal systems in Canada and the U.S. with differences in the division of federal and state/provincial powers , the economy of demographic size, not to mention different climates in each respective country with regard to civil litigation. Hopefully however, there will be… Read more »

Geoff
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“It’s a word that no one ever uses”

I’ll be no one then, I guess.

“It is within our power to declare independence and put in place a head of state that represents we the people or some such thing.”

We’ve been independent since 1931, and we have no ties to the “British monarchy” apart from the offices being held by one person. As for the Family Compact, I doubt the average Canadian has heard of it, at least outside of history class. Perhaps it’s you who hasn’t exited the Victorian age?

Rod Gillis
Guest
Rod Gillis

Hi Geoff. You are referring to the Westminster Statute of 1931. Good point, but not one that meets the test for full independence. The preferable benchmark for the kind of point you are attempting is the Repatriation of the Canadian Constitution in 1982. True political independence will come when Canada eventually becomes a republic. To borrow from Rene Levesque, “its a natural evolution”. I respect our constitutional monarchy, but look forward to the completion of the evolution. The Family Compact has its roots in the United Empire Loyalists. The unfamiliarity of the guy on the street with the term is… Read more »

Robert ian Williams
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Robert ian Williams

Canada became an independent Monarchy in 1931 and everything is done in the name of the Queen.

Rod Gillis
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Rod Gillis

Robert Ian Williams, if i may scoff a line from elsewhere, Canadians are not bees, why do we need a queen.