Thinking Anglicans

primates meeting: first reports on outcome

Updated Tuesday morning

Reuters Katie Nguyen Anglican Communion wants U.S. action in gay row

The Times Ruth Gledhill
Primates draw back from sanctions for liberal Anglican dioceses and later
Liberals uncensured as rift is patched up
and on her blog Anglican Covenant now published and TEC put on notice

Jim Naughton has Bishop Jefferts Schori’s initial reaction.

And he also has early reactions from bloggers.

Updates

Guardian Stephen Bates No schism for now: Williams gets tough on liberals to save the church

Daily Telegraph Jonathan Petre (website updated 9 am)
Anglican Church leaders give ultimatum to liberals and The Anglican crisis: Q&A and Katharine Jefferts Schori: unapologetic feminist and pro-gay liberal
Anglican primates struggle for consensus (new headline on older, now out of date story) and also The Anglican crisis and Hardliners warm to the woman they hate.

The Times further report Church deadline to curb gay rights and opinion column by Libby Purves Pray lift your eyes above the belt.

New York Times Sharon LaFraniere and Laurie Goodstein Anglicans Rebuke U.S. Branch on Same-Sex Unions

Los Angeles Times Morris Mwavizo and Rebecca Trounson Anglican leaders press for rift fix

Associated Press Elizabeth A Kennedy Anglican Leaders Rule on Gay Bishops

Episcopal News Service Matthew Davies
Design Group releases text of draft Anglican Covenant
Primates endorse pastoral council, primatial vicar in closing communiqué

BBC radio report on the Today programme by Robert Pigott, listen here:

Anglican archbishops have demanded that the liberal American church accept a separate organisation for breakaway traditionalist congregations.

Includes interviews with Mark Hill and Theo Hobson.

George Conger reports for the Living Church Overtime Required for Primates to Agree on Communiqué Wording.

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Lapinbizarre
Lapinbizarre
13 years ago

How, in God’s name, have we progressed from Thursday’s situation, when the Communion Sub-group, chaired by the Archbishop of Canterbury, concluded that ECUSA had largely met the “Windsor” requirements and expressed regrets that “other recommendations of the Windsor Report, addressed to other parts of the Communion, appear to have been ignored so far”, to tonight’s state of affairs, where a “pastoral council”, the majority of whose members are appointed outside ECUSA, will have authority to monitor the internal policies and practices of the American Church and to offer succour to groups that are in active, open rebellion against ECUSA. And… Read more »

Fr Joseph O'Leary
13 years ago

Grey, grey, grey, but that’s OK. It’s a trade-off between impaired autonomy and impaired communion. If I understand correctly, the secessionist parishes of ECUSA are now diverted from the dangerous embrace of Akinola back to the wider lap of the Anglican Communion. I spoke with a parishioner of Falls Church the other day, who described the pain of secession; now it looks as if the rift will be healed. The whole thing bears the stamp of Rowan Williams, reminding one of his minute and scrupulous examination of the synods of the early fourth century and their shadowy participants of subtly… Read more »

Weiwen
13 years ago

Any good liberal knows the cultural interpretation of turn the other cheek. you could only slap people with your right hand in those days. backhand slap – done only to slaves. after the master backhanded you, you turned your cheek, inviting another slap. problem was a) the master couldn’t backhand you with his left hand, it was unclean (or something). b) forehand slap = only done to equals. Jesus was breaking set. If we in the liberal side of the church think it’s a choice between the LGBT community and the Anglican Communion, we’re not thinking properly. And, frankly, on… Read more »

Fr Joseph O'Leary
13 years ago

My initial reaction was over-optimistic; I had missed this: “Archbishop Williams, looking discomfited, admitted that the cost of getting Archbishop Akinola to join the other primates in signing the unanimous communique was allowing him to continue to trespass on Episcopal church territory, at least for the present.” Well, perhaps Jefferts Schori will show amazing forbearance and persuade the ECUSA to walk that extra mile. Given the democratic nature of the ECUSA, the House of Bishops cannot hold back unilaterally on SSBs — they must persuade their flock to hold back for the purpose of ensuring communion — indeed, they should… Read more »

Fr Joseph O'Leary
13 years ago

While I see a lot of impetuous pique in those calling for schism on both sides, it may well happen that conscience on one side or both will make impaired communion unavoidable. Rowan Williams had an intriguing statement on that last year: “It is true that witness to what is passionately believed to be the truth sometimes appears a higher value than unity, and there are moving and inspiring examples in the twentieth century. If someone genuinely thinks that a move like the ordination of a practising gay bishop is that sort of thing, it is understandable that they are… Read more »

Fr Joseph O'Leary
13 years ago

Final impression of the Global South: their “firmness” and inflexibility comes from a refusal to reconsider their convictions, and this refusal is laced with homophobia. They at no point speak in a manner consonant with dialogue with gays or lesbians. Their willingness to follow the nakedly homophobic Akinola clearly indicates that their deepest motive is not concern for scriptural authority or church order but an unreflected rejection of dialogue with their gay-lesbian sisters and brothers. I know that such a judgement will sound shrill and one-sided, but it seems to me that the abundant documentation in this debate bears it… Read more »

Fr Joseph O'Leary
13 years ago

Surprisingly, Archbishop Peter Jensen of Sydney leaves open the possibility that the ECUSA attitudes are “prophetic and true”: http://your.sydneyanglicans.net/senior_clergy/archbishop_jensen/articles/truth_and_unity_collide

Lapinbizarre
Lapinbizarre
13 years ago

The Rowan Williams passage that Fr. O’Leary quotes is interesting. One feels great sympathy for Dr. Williams. It seems clear that during these past few days he has been deeply humiliated by Akinola and his supporters – the real reason for the way that the ground has shifted during this period. The archbishop’s main priority, of course, must be to preserve what unity remains in the Church of England. If the ongoing external interference in the affairs of ECUSA continues – and I think it certain that it will, for entirely too much human pride is invested in this situation… Read more »

NP
NP
13 years ago

Clarity, honesty,trust, real unity – that’s what we desperately need in the AC

Maybe “TEC GLobal” needs to be launched for that to occur for both the AC and TEC under its current HoB.

Cheryl Clough
13 years ago

Fr Joseph You obviously feel very strongly at this stage. On one of your earlier postings on this thread you commented that “Many gay men are sceptical of civil partnerships…” This is not just a gay male phenomenom. Many heterosexual males and females are sceptical of both civil partnerships, de facto relationships or even church marriages. In large part because there are a layer of people who only get married because they “have to”. There are another layer who get married for opportunistic reasons (e.g. the other partner’s assets) and are not honest about their motivations. There are another layer… Read more »

Cheryl Clough
13 years ago

I would like to see how things are played in the real world. Are people going to be genuinely hospitable to those they don’t approve of, or are they going to be machevelianly charming whilst planning how to eliminate the alternatives? One of the dynamics that has caused problems for Christianity (and many other faiths) over the eons is the attempt to supercede and replace previous covenants. This is an extract from a letter I sent to one such group this morning, and has some key principles that our own communion could benefit from contemplating: “Do not make a mistake… Read more »

Göran Koch-Swahne
13 years ago

The Covenant proposal does in fact look like a ”compromise” – one of the compromised kind inexperienced and dysfunctional meetings are wont to come up with. The Primates grants what is not theirs to those who have no right asking for it, at the expense of the holders – the church chosen for political attack. The “Once this scheme of pastoral care is recognised to be fully operational, the Primates undertake to end all interventions” is a clear warning that the drafters are not up to the task; No one can predicate an action on an action not within their… Read more »

Kendall Harmon
13 years ago

Father O’Leary, you do yourself no service when you mischaracterize those with whom you disagree. The thing that matters here is that Anglicanism find a way to be a genuinely catholic church. When I said there was but a thread left earlier in the week, I was talking about for the Communion. If there is a split, everyone loses. We need to have a sense here of the greater good. The report, which was inaccurate and was implicitly critiqued in the final communique, would have made, in my view, schism more likely. I believe in the present situation there is… Read more »

kieran crichton
kieran crichton
13 years ago

And for his next trick, the ABC will get over his post-colonial guilt and tell the Nigerians where to stick their extra-provincial meddling. Won’t he?

Matthew Duckett
Matthew Duckett
13 years ago

As I understand it Robert Piggot’s comment below is not accurate: “Anglican archbishops have demanded that the liberal American church accept a separate organisation for breakaway traditionalist congregations.” It looks to be more analogous to the Church of England’s Provincial Episcopal Visitor scheme (= flying bishops), as the Primatial Vicar, although appointed with some representation from outside TEC, is to receive consent and delegated authority from the Presiding Bishop of TEC. Thus, as far as I can see, there is no “separate” organisation being set up here, and certainly no parallel church. The breakaway groups have been told that they… Read more »

Pluralist
13 years ago

I’m away in Cambridge and able to react from a commercialised NHS hospital and at a rush of digesting this news. It seems to me it hangs on this primatial vicar taking over from Akinola, via the original suggestion of the Presiding Bishop. At the same time, the Episcopal Church has to freeze its intentions. The power that Akinola has by being in the US already has pushed the thing his way, at some steps from the Sub-Group report, but not completely. It seems to me to be a mess, one where clarity and best result is saying to TEC… Read more »

Simon Sarmiento
13 years ago

Matthew
That was the Today programme blurb from the BBC website, not (AFAIK) a quote from Robert.

Craig Nelson
13 years ago

Just to say, briefly, that it’s of course too early to come to a final conclusion on all of this. It seems that if TEC stays within the Anglican fold as currently constituted that they won’t be able to ordain gay bishops or publicise a same sex blessing ritual until a wider consensus emerges (one that we haven’t even managed to accomplish in our own Province of England or any other province apart form Canada). And of course I’m very sad about that. Apart form anything this allows a prolonged cooling off period, which in the long run will turn… Read more »

Ford Elms
Ford Elms
13 years ago

“It took the American Church at least 3 decades to move to where it is now, and even there the move has been painful and difficult.” And it isn’t all of TEC that has gotten to “where it is now”. The thing is that certain parts of TEC took Lambeth ’88, and before, seriously, listened, and found they couldn’t depersonalize gay people any more. Whether or not they have made the right decisions as a result is another story. The point is they made these decisions fully aware that they were talking about fully human beings, not some poor afflicted… Read more »

Prior Aelred
13 years ago

Just a thought, I’m wondering what would happen if the TEC HoB proclaimed moratoria (as per WR) for a certain specified time frame (only) to allow for the listening process that Lambeth requested & which has only been done by TEC (& possibly the Anglican Church of Canada) AND to allow time for the foreign bishops who have recruited parishes from TEC to apologize and withdraw.

But I am very interested to see what ++Katharine will do with this.

Bob
Bob
13 years ago

I find myself with a sad deja vu of another Brit waving a paper and saying peace in our time.

Cheryl Clough
13 years ago

Ford The emotions of your experience are not unique to GLBTs. Try being a bleeding heart liberal in an archconservative diocese where you are told that the suffering in Africa is okay because it’s part of God’s plan. Try keeping a straight face when the leaders of that same diocese try to come out batting as the most moral crusaders for the African continent. Try being a woman in an abusive marriage. Try being a child being molested by people “in” with the church leadership. Trying being an indigineous parent who has had their children stolen, or one of those… Read more »

Merseymike
Merseymike
13 years ago

Craig ; I don’t agree.

I think the time has come to give up on the Anglican Communion and for all gay people to leave the Anglican church

If TEC hasn’t got the courage of its convictions, that will be sad, but there is absolutely no way that I would step into a CofE church again.

Fr Joseph O'Leary
13 years ago

Canon Kendall, I was not referring to your own postings so much as to the comboxes full of stuff about giving the TEC a noose to hang themselves with.

Ford Elms
Ford Elms
13 years ago

Merseymike,
For all I can see, leaving the Anglican Church hasn’t helped you much. You are incredibly angry and resentful when it comes to the Church. Unless you were even moreso before, leaving the Church really hasn’t helped you at all. You obviously bear large scars on your soul, if leaving the Church has helped them heal, it doesn’t show. With that parting word I take my leave. It’s Lent, and I am fasting from Thinking Anglicans for the next 6 weeks at least.

Erika Baker
Erika Baker
13 years ago

I may be posting on the wrong thread here… I’m getting more and more frustrated at the conservative’s efforts to reduce my relationship to sexual activity. It’s like describing the feeling of putting your baby to your breast for the first time in the words of using a Mothercare breast pump! As Elm speaks of Lent, I’ve been feeling particuarly on the defensive today and my prayer for Lent this year has to be that God may keep finding me and help me not to become cynical, angry or disillusioned. Reading all those posts from angry and disappointed people is… Read more »

Merseymike
Merseymike
13 years ago

No, Ford. I simply wish to oppose homophobia. And I think it is primarily located within institutional religion.Thus, I oppose it. In this journey I have come to realise that much of traditional Christianity is nonsense, in my opinion. So, your approach no longer makes any sense to me – simply because I don’t regard myself as a ‘Christian’ in the way you might define it. My only interest is in opposing homophobia. I really couldn’t care less about either the Church as an institution or Christianity as a religion. If it is positive towards gay equality then I will… Read more »

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