Thinking Anglicans

Scottish responses to Anglican documents

Two documents are available from the Scottish Episcopal Church.

The bishops have published a response to the letter issued in February by the meeting of Anglican primates in Alexandria.

College of Bishops Respond to Anglican Primatesā€™ Letter of February 2009 is available as a PDF file.

The Faith and Order Board has responded to the St Andrews Draft of the proposed Anglican Covenant.

A Response from the Faith and Order Board of the Scottish Episcopal Church is also available as a PDF file.

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drdanfeeruidhMartin ReynoldsRev L RobertsJCF Recent comment authors
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Charlotte
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Charlotte

I have a dream. The response of the Scottish Episcopal College of Bishops to the Anglican Primates’ Letter of February 2009 is adopted by the Episcopal Church at General Convention 2009 as the replacement for B 033. It is much clearer and much more sensible than the 2006 resolution, notoriously drafted in haste.

Pluralist
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It’s a holding operation: my view and the .PDFs turned into text at my blog:

http://pluralistspeaks.blogspot.com/2009/03/recently-i-have-been-downloading-and.html

Rev L Roberts
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Rev L Roberts

Weasle words from Scotland. What a useless, spineless crew is their ‘College’.

Please don’t bother to strain yourselves any longer, at giving the appearance of welcoming ‘homosexual persons’–condescending tosh.

Forget it.

Rev L Roberts
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Rev L Roberts

A dream ?

That souns more like a nightmare to me.

I write as one of these ‘homosexual persons’ they are so intent on patronsing. We are meant to keep shtum about it, right ?

Father Ron Smith
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Father Ron Smith

“3. Cross-border incursions by Bishops: no member of the (Scottish Episcopal) College of Bishops has engaged in a cross-border incursion and the view of the College is that the existing geographical boundaries of Provinces and Dioceses within the Anglican Communion should be observed” This paragraph from the response of the Scottish Bishops to the Letter from the Meeting of the Primates at Alexandria is perhaps the most helpful part of their response. One wonders if they have any response to the recent statements by the Archbishop of Nigeria vilifying the LGBT community in that country. Also, in view of the… Read more »

Father Ron Smith
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Father Ron Smith

“There are practical doubts over whether a Covenant can in any case be a practical means of addressing the issues which our Communion is currently facing. We note with sadness that ‘cross-border’ incursions on episcopal jurisdiction have not stopped at the present time, despite the call for a moratorium.” – Scottish Bishops response to the Covenant – Having already noted their own view on border-crossing within the Anglican Communion, the College of Bishops is now clearly identifying the problem of this activity still taking place, even though the perpetrators (Nigeria and CANA et al)are insisting on the observance of the… Read more »

Rosemary Hannah
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Rosemary Hannah
Cynthia Gilliatt
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Cynthia Gilliatt

“I write as one of these ‘homosexual persons’ they are so intent on patronsing.”

Me too.

And I take exception to being named with a name I do not use for myself. “Homosexual” suggets that my identity is exclusively rooted in what I do in bed. I am gay 24/7. Do the good Scots refer to the other part of humanity as “heterosexual persons?”

It took a while, but TEC now refers to us as ‘gay and lesbian.’ We’re working on the ‘b’ and ‘t’ parts.

David Bayne
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David Bayne

Unless Rev L Roberts was planning to offer himself for election in one of the impending episcopal vacancies in Glasgow and Galloway and Argyll and the Isles, I don’t think he needs to get in too much of a lather about what’s happening in Scotland. I think it’s fair to say we’re generally ahead of the Anglican curve in the acceptance and inclusion of all sorts and conditions of humanity: women priests are now eligible for the episcopate; earlier this month I attended the collation of a partnered gay priest; I believe some particularly radical congregations even welcome married heterosexuals… Read more »

Charlotte
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Charlotte

Well, I seem to have provoked some disagreement. I suppose I don’t read the document the way others do. In my reading, the Scottish Episcopal Church gives its reluctant consent to a minimal interpretation of the first two Windsor moratoria, while making their reluctance to do so very, very clear. They say also their desire is to move forward on full inclusion as soon as it can be done without breaking the Communion. Finally, they clearly repudiate cross-border incursions, calling those who engage in them to account. I do think some such document is needed from the Episcopal Church also… Read more »

Ford Elms
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Ford Elms

David Bayne: thank you. I heartily agree. And I speak as one of those homosexuals who not only doesn’t feel patronized by the Scottish bishops, but am glad that there can be such even minded people in the Church.

Jeff Allison
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Jeff Allison

I believe the problem is that any moratorium and or concession to holding off and inaction is against a group of our Christian Bothers and Sisters.
Yes, they seem reluctant to agree, but never-the-less they have agreed to a moratorium.

Rev L Roberts
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Rev L Roberts

I write as one of these ‘homosexual persons’ they are so intent on patronsing.” Me too. And I take exception to being named with a name I do not use for myself. “Homosexual” suggets that my identity is exclusively rooted in what I do in bed. I am gay 24/7. Do the good Scots refer to the other part of humanity as “heterosexual persons?” It took a while, but TEC now refers to us as ‘gay and lesbian.’ We’re working on the ‘b’ and ‘t’ parts. Posted by: Cynthia Gilliatt on Wednesday, 25 March 2009 at 12:13pm GMT Yes, that’s… Read more »

Rev L Roberts
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Rev L Roberts

I believe the problem is that any moratorium and or concession to holding off and inaction is against a group of our Christian Bothers and Sisters. Yes, they seem reluctant to agree, but never-the-less they have agreed to a moratorium. Posted by: Jeff Allison on Wednesday, 25 March 2009 at 4:24pm GMT Please bear in mind our lesbian Brothers and Sisters whether church-goers or not. You might want to extend some care , thought and loyalty towards them / us. I would not give too much succour to those Churchmen who oppress gay and lesbian people with impunity, deadly results… Read more »

JCF
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JCF

It’s not as bad as it could have been, but it’s far from the Gospel’s calling. [Is it just me, or does anyone else find the “no bishop may even ATTEND an SSB” particularly galling? What if it were his own (adult) child’s partnership being blessed? šŸ™ ]

Rev L Roberts
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Rev L Roberts

Yes it is very galling and self-serving. They sound so pleased with themselves. Are we all supposed to cheer, or what ?

It’s not as bad as it could have been, but it’s far from the Gospel’s calling. [Is it just me, or does anyone else find the “no bishop may even ATTEND an SSB” particularly galling? What if it were his own (adult) child’s partnership being blessed? šŸ™ ]

Posted by: JCF on Wednesday, 25 March 2009 at 7:22pm GMT

Martin Reynolds
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Martin Reynolds

I’m with Laurie on this.

It is an appalling document.

Williams has an unexpected recruit to supervise the new Anglican ghetto. I suppose it matters that they seem to be so reluctant but the effect is the same.

Martin Reynolds
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Martin Reynolds

This makes the role of Idris as one of the Primatial Patrons of Inclusive Church rather awkward – He must resign.

ruidh
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ruidh

I read the Scottish letter and it accurately states the facts. The response to the facts is reasonable. Our desire to have full inclusion of glbt persons in the life of the church is in tension with the very incomplete acceptance of that position within both the Communion and our individual churches. We are, in fact, not of one mind and honoring the moratorium on consecrations to the Episcopate is, while not an ideal response from our point of view, it is one that we should be able to live with. To insist otherwise is to insist on further widening… Read more »

drdanfee
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drdanfee

The new SEC documents reflect their respective occasions, as I read them both. The problem with the brief document on moratoria is, as its own comments acknowledge, Nobody much knows exactly what such Anglican moratoria are, nor when they end or how, and what real global worlds use they are, all said and done. The underlying dis-ease of the document has mainly to do with its singular inabilities to know whether queer folks are definitively Outsiders (traditional religious views) or Insiders (changed religious views). Nor is the document at all sure whether the traditional ways are mistreatment or injustice; or… Read more »